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Current Replies for Up wind performance C & C 27-3
 
  Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (AEOLUS)
Posted: 12:15:48 pm on 9/12/2017 Modified: Never
 
I  have 1982 27-3.  This is the end of my 3rd season racing and cruising. We have new sails. Dacron 155 and 125. A 5 year old main with three batters. We race very well fast on a reach or off the wind and great with the spinnaker. We can't seem to get the hang of it upwind. We get beat by Grampian 29 and Columbia 9.6 regularly. Even a nonesuch 32 beats us.  What are we doing wrong?Other tubs point at least 10degrees higher then us. 3 seasons it's getting frustrating.
  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (doogymon)
Posted: 10:55:28 pm on 9/15/2017 Modified: Never
 
Hi AEOLUS
New headsails and folding prop. She points much better now and at front of the pack. CS33, C&C32 and a Niagara 35 bunch of others coupled with a tight course. Downwind has improved significantly,not sure why. Old headsails had to crack off.Headstay is nice and taunt.The start is very important. Our tacks & gybes are sharp.Make sure to be on the right side of the wind i.e. not getting fouled by others.David told me to get a 27 vice a 30. I'm glad I did.
Cheers
Doog
SunnyJ
  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (AEOLUS)
Posted: 3:16:48 pm on 9/18/2017 Modified: Never
 
Thanks for the help. We have brand new sails one 125 from evolution. and one 155 from doyle. Folding prop next season I guess. I have an adjustable backstay . I thought with the back stay ,I could have a looser forstay and pull on the backstay when it got windier.As far as the sails go are you suggesting something else?

thanks again

jeff

Jeff Yanchuk
Aeolus, C&C 27 Mk 3
Thunder Bay YC, Thunder Bay Ontario

  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (davidww1)
Posted: 11:15:08 am on 9/19/2017 Modified: Never
 
Have you read Black Arts - Tuning The Rig, Mks I to IV? That's a good starting point for rig setup.

The fact that you do well on a reach or run despite the solid prop yet dog it upwind suggests to me that your upwind sail trim is fundamentally flawed. Can you get someone with a good eye for sails to go for a ride with you and cut that 10% deficit down to something manageable? If you do get such a person aboard, get him or her to tell you what is being done and take notes while it happens.


David Weatherston
Towser, Toronto
C&C 27 Mk IV

  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (AEOLUS)
Posted: 11:42:50 am on 9/19/2017 Modified: Never
 
Thanks for the response David, I have read the rig tuning on the site , it doesn't say much about forestry tension. We have a loose gauge and tension and measure the rig before each season. We have a small shim under the mast for some rake. ( maybe the problem?)  I had a friend race with me last Monday in the blowing. My number 2 and a full main. He could not point any better then me. He suggested my tracks should be inside more. But in the black arts my Genoa tracks are similar to the three boats. It seems like when we sheet the Genoa in , it is flat as a pancake.  Not much curve . If I back off the sheet we are faster but pointing is worse. My friends all have fractional rigs with tiny headsails. I need a C&C guy to come with me. I sailed my 24 much better upwind. How close to the rear shroud should my track be ?  It seems like car position to me.

Jeff Yanchuk
Aeolus, C&C 27 Mk 3
Thunder Bay YC, Thunder Bay Ontario

  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (Steve Reid)
Posted: 7:01:15 pm on 9/19/2017 Modified: Never
 
Jeff:
Because you say that "when we sheet the Genoa in, it is flat as a pancake" it sounds to me like you might be using too much halyard tension.
Also I've always found that in very light air and in big air you need a slightly softer headstay but in medium (say 7 - 12 kts) a really tight headstay is best, headstay tension is a function of backstay tension.

Steve Reid
  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (AEOLUS)
Posted: 7:51:16 pm on 9/19/2017 Modified: Never
 
Hi Steve, most of our problems are in windy conditions above 12knots. We crank the Genoa halyard very tight for heavy wind. Our 125 is new. Just can't seem to get the shape right. In the past lite wind loose halyard back stay off. Med wind some tension on the halyard abit of backstay.  Heavy wind  halyard cranked tight. Backstay on lots. I'm better with the 155 upwind. It takes a bit for us to get a handle on it but we get it. The number 2/125 has been frustrating.  

Jeff Yanchuk
Aeolus, C&C 27 Mk 3
Thunder Bay YC, Thunder Bay Ontario

  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (Roger Gibb)
Posted: 8:45:37 pm on 9/19/2017 Modified: Never
 
I have a vessel of similar vintage. So here's something not yet mentioned that I picked up from this site many years ago, and which made a very substantial difference for us, namely distribution of crew weight. When we started to pay attention I'd say we picked up at least half a knot and started winning races.
We have a wheel on Passtime, which for racing is a disadvantage because the weight of the helm is not as flexible.

Roger Gibb


Passtime (27-4)

  Re: Up wind performance C & C 27-3 (AEOLUS)
Posted: 12:08:56 pm on 9/20/2017 Modified: Never
 
Hi Roger , I also have wheel steering that I don't really like compared to the tiller on my C&C 24. I sail with a crew of 3 plus myself.  In heavy wind i put them on the rail just behind the rear shroud. We just got an incline gauge this year. Can anyone tell me the preferred angles of these boats in say lite med heavy wind?

Jeff Yanchuk
Aeolus, C&C 27 Mk 3
Thunder Bay YC, Thunder Bay Ontario