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All sails are now sold. Thank you to the forum and to all who looked and inquired. Have a great season!Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
There are 3 sails remaining available for sale. They are:
The Mainsail:
This is a Doyle, Tape-Drive gray Pentax sail purchased from Doyle Sails, Detroit in 2009. This sail is not a “cheap sail.” It was a premium, expensive sail when I purchased it and I “babied” it, using it in light-air conditions and only a few times. It is in exceptional, as new, condition. This will fit either a MK III or a MK IV rig. It can be seen on eBay at: http://www.ebay.com/itm/111905737944?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649
Headsails:
1) Doyle. Light #1 - 155%. I purchased from Doyle Sales, Detroit, 2010. This is also, not a “cheap sail.” I asked Al at Doyle Sails for a premium sail that would excel in light wind (1-8 knots) and he delivered. This will move your boat when the rest of the fleet can’t manage steerage. Lightly used, exceptional, near new condition. Also on eBay at: http://www.ebay.com/itm/111905750497?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649
2) Doyle. #3–110% - Doyle, purchased from Doyle Sales, Detroit, 2010. Used three times. This #3 is perfect for the times you find yourself sailing in 20 knot winds. It is a blade type with battens and reef points which reduce the sail to a 95% sail. This sail would fit on an MK III or MK IV rig. Exceptional, near new condition. Also on eBay at: http://www.ebay.com/itm/111905789307?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1558.l2649
SHIPPING: The sails are located in southern Wisconsin. The 3 above sails are available for FREE shipping to the lower 48 states and actual shipping costs to Canada. I’ve used FedEx for all the other sails I’ve sold, and yes, one was sold to a Canadian fellow. I did not use eBay shipping for the sails in an effort to find the lowest shipping costs. Still, it is expensive to ship to Canada as a portion of the shipping cost involves Taxes/Customs/Duties. I’m required to complete a customs form which asks for the value of the item. I list the honest, actual sale price as the value.
QUALITY, CONDITION & PACKAGE DEAL: These are premium quality sails in exceptional condition. I’m selling them at half the original cost and less than half the price of a new sail today of equal quality. I will entertain reasonable offers for a “package” deal if someone wants all 3 or even 2 of the sails. Unfortunately, the reasonable "package deal" will probably not be enough to fully compensate for an unfavorable exchange rate, taxes or high shipping costs.Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
I have 6 sails for sale. I’ve sold my boat with a good compliment of cruising sails and the new owner had no intention to do any club/Wednesday night racing so he didn’t’ want to pay extra for these.
These sails are all made specifically for a 1980 C&C 27 MK III, hull #858. All have Luff Tape #5 to fit Tuff-Luff foil or most roller furling foils.
The six sails I have are:
Mainsail: Doyle, Tape-Drive gray Pentax sail purchased from Doyle Sails, Detroit in 2009. Very lightly used, near new condition.
Headsails:
1) Doyle. Light #1 - 155%. I purchased from Doyle Sales, Detroit, 2010. This sail excels in light wind (1-8 knots) and will move your MK III when the rest of the fleet can’t manage steerage. Lightly used, near new condition.
2) AirForce. Heavy #1 – 150%. Purchased in 2009, used from another C&C 27 MK III owner. This sail was used by Clare Jorden on his boat “Aragorn” when he was doing club racing. I purchased this along with a #2 and used them in club racing in the Duluth MN. The stitching is in good condition, the tack, head & clew are in good condition and while the sail cloth is not as stiff as new, it is stiff, crisp and in very good condition.
3) AirForce. #2–130% AirForce, purchased 2009, used from another C&C 27 MK III owner. This sail was used by Clare Jorden on his boat “Aragorn” when he was doing club racing. I purchased this along with a #1 and used them in club racing in the Duluth MN. This sail is in as good or better than the #1 above.
4) North Sails. #2–130% - Dacron. This sail was purchased new in 2004 by the previous owner of my boat and it came with the boat when I bought it in 2005. It was used by the previous owner for one season, cruising. I used it very little. When cruising I either used a #1 or a #3. The stitching is tight and shows no fraying or UV degradation. The sail is clean, stiff and retains the majority of its resin and shape. Excellent condition.
5) Doyle. #3–110% - Doyle, purchased from Doyle Sales, Detroit, 2010. Used three times. This #3 is perfect for heavy weather sailing. It is a blade type with battens and reef points which reduce the sail to a 95% sail. Near new condition.
If you have an interest in any of these sails, please contact me directly. Email: sschoeler27(at)gmail(dot)com.Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
Nice job on the repair Tim. It's nice to see the salvation of another 27. I've seen several deck recores with foam in the last few years and probably a few more with balsa, either is fine, it's all in the application. Sorry about your paint woes. Painting certainly seems to be so much tougher. The slightest little contaminate will affect the outcome. Hopefully your current paint job will be a lasting one. Thanks for the pics & story!Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
Foam core material has been used for nearly as many years as end-grained balsa but it has not been as widely used as balsa primarily due to cost and the success of balsa. J/Boats among many other builders are still using balsa in their deck and hull construction. When asked about it, Johnstone replied; “…we use balsa because it’s still the best material. When correctly applied its stronger and offers better sheer resistance than any of the foams. If foam was better, we’d use it.” Manufacturers using foam core material will disagree and provide their side of the argument. I feel it’s not worth debating Foam Vs. Balsa as there are many examples of successful, long-lasting, well-constructed builds of each. In the case of re-coring, the proven method has been to use like-kind material, i.e. use what the original builders used: end-grained balsa and polyester resin. However, many repair facilities are using West Systems Epoxy resin due to its low VOC, better adhesion and low shrink properties. But it’s much more expensive and the application must precisely follow the manufacturer’s instructions. The key successes in re-coring is providing a clean connection to the existing material, correctly filling all the “channels” between the blocks and properly saturating both the balsa and the fiberglass. Don’t be overwhelmed. It’s not rocket science. It’s simply paying attention to the detail of application. Practice on rebuilding a couple hatch covers like the anchor locker or cockpit hatch covers. Visit some repair shops who’ve done this and ask questions. Also, ask some of the folks on this site who’ve done it like Allan of “Cygnus” above and others. There is great wisdom to be gained from the experience of others and these people are amazingly willing to share their experience with another C&C ownerScott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
Good plan and yes, order the 1/2" balsa.Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
I’m not certain where on deck you’re referring but in most cases, most of the deck is cored with ½” end-grained balsa. And I’m not sure exactly what you mean by “moist core issue”. Usually when someone is talking about re-coring, it is far beyond “moist”. Regarding repair, there are as many differing opinions as there are owners & repairers. Again generally, if the area is relatively large, it’s best to open it from the top, remove the bad, prep, replace and finish, permitting gravity to aid you in the repair. The Black Arts section of this site has excellent examples and this is by far the most established method and has proven the test of time. Repairing from the underside is a constant argument with gravity, but in certain conditions it is potentially a good solution such as posted by sony2000. I know I’ll get comments for this but in my opinion, drilling holes in the deck, filling with epoxy, etc., is a disrespectful thing to do to a boat. If you properly repair the boat, it will last you for your entire boating life and well into another’s. If you've got a deck core problem, fix it right the first time. There's an old saying; "If you want your boat to care for you at sea, see you care for her the same way at shore." I realize you're probably not "going to sea" but the point is still one of the best statements I've heard when it comes to maintenance.Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
[Scott neglected to mention that he is an accredited marine surveyor http://www.c3marine.com/ . He's probably seen more soggy decks and deck repairs, good and bad, than the rest of us combined. His advice is worthy of serious consideration. - Admin]
I presume the author is referring to a spare sail slug.Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
There is little that can be added to what has already been written and posted on this topic in the Black Arts section of this site. Start there and if you have questions after you're set up, come on back to the forum.Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
That designed system was installed in production style for several years and exists/remains in boats that are in use today, 30 – 40 years later. Some are wrapped with a protective insulation for the hot side of the exhaust and others are not. Specifically why the design concept was dropped from production installation, I don’t know. In two cases that I inspected, I was permitted to run the engine with a carbon monoxide detector in the locker with the exhaust system. The locker tested positive within seconds. The issues you mention are the primary reasons for replacement. The other issues involve the materials used, multiple connection points as sources for failure & leaks, and the location of every installation I’ve seen. All have been located in a cockpit locker with everything from burned sail bags and melted fenders to anchors on top and tightly around and the exhaust system. Modern systems have few connection points and strategically placed to mitigate leaks, tested and proven materials, and are installed in areas least likely to have equipment stowed on top of them. In this case as well as most others like it, if the system was fully restored using current, approved exhaust materials and it could be more appropriately installed, it would be suitable. But I'm not sure why anyone would do that. The replacement installations I've seen are neater, cleaner and safer.Scott Schoeler, Hull 858, "Scot-Free"
It is original. I’ve seen one on a ’72 (that is still in languishing in someone’s wooded lot) and on a bunch of other late 60’s and early 70’s A-4 installations in other boats such as Ericson, Pearson & Tartan. I’ve read the discussion on the Moyer site regarding this and I disagree with the advise to keep/restore the exhaust system. There have been significant safety and efficiency improvements in the last 30 years with regard to gas engine exhaust systems, to say nothing of the fact that this boat has spent some time in salt water and the interior of this system is questionable at best. This fortunate new owner should avail himself of a new, safe, efficient exhaust system. Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
I’ve seen many C&C 26’s & 27’s of all ages and have never seen one with a weak keel box area. Echoing what David indicated, you may find that the problem is not with a weak hull box area at all. The problem may be in the keel to hull joint which is serious but a less messy issue to resolve. My boat has the heavy “wide bands” you describe and David accurately explains. I’ve tugged on my keel when it was in the travel-hoist slings (while it was hung just above my trailer’s posts for obvious safety reasons) without any noticeable effect of hull flexing. Your description of the test for hull flexing and subsequent descriptions begs many more questions (including the point that David makes regarding why it sounds like your keel was “hanging” and not seated on the center base of the cradle) and we could go back and forth with questions and answers for a long time. But your questions and concerns are best answered by the personal inspection of a marine repair professional while it’s in the slings with proper safety measures. Hull flexing when the keel is pulled side to side from the bottom is a common problem among San Juan 24’s, 28’s, Ranger 28’s and many other makes and models including J-Boats. I was privileged to be given access when a local facility “stiffened” a San Juan 24 hull around the keel box area. (The “stiffer” hull made a remarkable difference in performance on Wednesday nights.) In this case the sole was cut away so the interior of the hull could be fully accessed. After the hull was “stiffened” using modern, high-tech materials, the sole was replaced by tabbing stringers on the interior hull which were also tabbed to the remaining interior pan so as to maintain the original structural integrity of the interior hull liner/pan. The stringers also added “stiffness” to the hull. A plywood teak & holly sole was fastened to the stringers and the whole repair was very nicely finished. Because the facility had done this before, they knew what they were doing and thus the cost was mitigated and considered to be modest. The owner liked the boat and felt the repair was a good investment long term. After the first few weeks of use, he was very happy with the result. If you don’t need to destroy the cabin sole portion of the hull pan, don’t. There are many solutions to an “unsightly” cabin sole without “replacing” it.
As already suggested, it’s best to talk with a repair facility that is familiar with, and has fixed the problem on other boats like the case referenced above rather than a run-of-the-mill fiberglass repair shop.
Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
[Scott is a marine surveyor with significant knowledge of boat construction. See http://www.c3marine.com/ . - Admin]
I'm bringing this thread back up as I'm involved in a re-fit and am wondering if anybody used or has any new information about the Australian Cableport product mentioned in Windy Day's posting. Is there a North American importer or source?Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
This is an interesting posting. The question of wintering a mast-up or mast-down is certainly not new. When I was living in upstate NY, on Lake Ontario, the local marina did not have the capability to haul-out a boat with the mast up and consequently all boats had their masts unstepped and even if the boat was stored outdoors, the mast was stored on a “wall rack” in the barn. With local marinas at the Head of the Lakes and all marinas I know of on the south shore of Lake Superior, it is standard practice to leave the mast up on all boats stored outdoors. Having worked a few claims of boats that “topple,” as David puts it, I’ve noted that some have had masts up and some have been down. But in all cases, the real culprit of the “topple” was improper jack-stand blocking. (Jack-stand blocking is well discussed & described in the Black Arts section so I’ll stick, up or down, to the subject here.)
With the claim interests in mind and a question I didn’t feel was answered, I asked a couple marina managers, yard supervisors and a rigging firm their opinion regarding the issue. To a person, all said there is merit in getting the mast down annually for a thorough inspection. And to a person, all said masts and specifically the standing rigging can be damaged in the unstepping and winter storage process if the operators of the gin pole unstepping equipment aren’t careful. In other words, more damage can be caused from unstepping a mast than from leaving it alone if it’s not done properly. So the answer I was hearing was, if it can be done correctly unstepping the mast and inspecting it annually will yield a safer rig. On the other hand, leaving it up is better than risking damage from a bad unstepping process. If it is solely a money issue, meaning an owner doesn’t want to pay for professional unstepping and is laying claim to the “…it hasn’t failed yet” philosophy; I feel they will inevitably face the “…pay me now or pay me later” scenario. As the saying “If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it” doesn’t apply to rig maintenance. So, when asked about the issue, my answer is: If you leave yours up, (you’re not necessarily an evil person) it would be prudent to go up the mast annually to check fittings, rings, pins, tape and perform maintenance as needed. If you take yours down, (you’re not necessarily a righteous person) check everything before you put it back up. Because the goal is, you want it up and you want it to stay up for as long as you need it up.
Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
I knew when I made my request that it would likely elicit the advice to recommend seeking other options. Sailors are notorious for having strong opinions based on personal experience and a willingness to share them. I am no exception. Despite warnings and suggestions, my friend is still persisting in replacing his CNG stove with a pressure alcohol stove. He can’t get CNG anywhere, has owned a boat with a pressure alcohol stove but not experienced the pressure alcohol horrors of others. He is a friend whom I owe a favor and I promised to look for a stove for him and let him make the decision. He may still decide on another recommended option but that will be up to him.
Thanks for your advice (with which I agree) and thanks for your helping me with my promise.
Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
I have a good friend who is looking for an alcohol stove for his 29. I have read through some of the archived posts about replacing alcohol with propane and am hoping someone still has their old one in the basement or the rafters of the garage. If you have one or know where I could direct him to find a good, working used one, please let me know. E-mail me at Scott (at) C3Marine (dot) com. Thanks. Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
Bjorki; Sorry for the delay in getting back to you on this, it's been a busy spring. And I'm sorry for my curt reply earlier. I was in a hurry and didn't have time to give you any background. Anyway, a few years ago a guy in Rochester NY had a Ranger 29 on stands. Late in the fall the back keel block sank, putting all the weight of the back half of the boat on the two jack stands. To shorten the story; the concaved areas "mostly" returned and the boat was launched. When it was hauled in the fall, after cleaning the bottom he noticed there were blisters on the hull for the first time. The only place the blisters appeared were where the back jack stand pads were. That's when I was called in. It was an old boat and the marina and owner worked it out but it sent me to my back yard. I had an old Fox 18 I'd been given after it washed up on the rocks during a storm. I tipped it back on some pop-its and let it sit for the summer. The hull caved in like I'd hoped and I cut some sections out to see what was going on with the laminates. The best I can describe it is to take a narrow strip of thin plywood and bend it. The laminated layers bend at different rates and very minutely separate. But they don't separate enough to notice from any outside appearance. I used a small hand-held microscope I bought from Radio Shack, magnified the cross-cut section 600 times and I could clearly see there was separation. Back to the Ranger 29, that's why the blisters showed up. There was an incredibly small void for the water to collect, and it did. I've seen several similar situations since then and tried to follow a few. Some developed problems, some didn't. The best words of wisdom are; It's best if it never happed so always make sure the blocking is backed by bulkheads. But if it does happen, shorter is better and the quicker you can take the pressure off the fewer problems show up. I encourage you to get the boat back in its place on the cradle (if you haven't already) and work on the concaved areas. You might try heating the areas with a heat lamp, inside and out, to warm the areas to the touch. Be careful not to over heat. You want to be able to hold your hand flat on the hull and it's best to do this before fresh bottom paint is applied for the season. A yard did this and I was told it worked well. Best of luck.
Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0pt;">No, it’s not ok and it may not be fine. Define Fine. Will it float? Probably and that’s fine? The hull laminates are being affected by the stresses imposed and steps should be taken to properly stand the boat. It should have been returned to be supported by the cradle supports after the rudder was removed. I wouldn’t assume the contractor knows what he’s doing. What you can be sure he knows is that it’s not his boat. It sounds like a lazy contractor who didn’t want to make the effort to raise and lower the boat properly. He took the rudder last fall? And it’s still not ready? I’d have a number of questions for that contractor. The hull MAY regain it’s shape but the concave areas and the areas around them were and are being adversely affected by the stress.Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
e=3>Growing up in the central part of Minnesota where all sailboats were small and all had outboards, I loved the ease of care & maintenance.es"> </SPAN>I moved and began sailing the Great Lakes; Erie, Michigan & Ontario and stubbornly stuck with an egg beater hanging off the transom for two boats, a Chrysler & a Hunter.es"> </SPAN>Every time the lake got lumpy, the egg beater came out.es"> </SPAN>Outboards gave me fits when I needed them the most.es"> </SPAN>They seemed to push the boat OK against a current but waves made them useless.es"> </SPAN>Moving up to bigger boats, my experience with the Atomic 4 was that it worked great after it was rebuilt and updated and the clapping diesels were wonderful.es"> </SPAN>I vowed I’d never go back to an outboard unless I was back on Lake Darling in a day sailor.es"> </SPAN>With all due respect to those who made comments about their outboard on their 27, I’m going to have to encourage you, if at all possible, to stick with an inboard; rebuild or re-power but keep the iron inside the boat. Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
T face="Times New Roman" size=3>Greg;
T face="Times New Roman" size=3>Getting the bilge dry shouldn’t be too much of a problem. <SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Sponge, rags, etc., can get the water out and make it relatively dry.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Keeping the water out is probably a bigger issue.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> S</SPAN>ome marinas will install a small, flush & fare, threaded thru-hull at the low point in the bilge.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I’ve seen many power boats thus with more and more older sailboats getting them installed. <SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>They remove (unscrew) the threaded thru-hull from the bilge allowing the water that seeps in at various points and times over the winter that finds it’s way to the bilge to run out the thru-hull.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Obviously, some are averse to drilling another hole in the hull.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Me for example.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>It’s hard to get a typical stock tarp wrapped around a boat in such a way that keeps all the water out—I’ve never seen one so if someone has one, please send me a picture.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Many people use an antifreeze in the bilge to prevent the water that gets in from freezing.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The type of antifreeze is important.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The pink stuff is non—diluteable.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>This means when water is added to it, it does not chemically mix with the antifreeze.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The label specifically states to remove all water and add no water.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>It also states that it is not for use in winterizing engines.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>There is an antifreeze, sold by Seafit that is diluteable and protects against burst to -60F.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>A half gallon should be enough.
T face="Times New Roman" size=3>On the issue of windshield washer fluid/antifreeze for use in winterizing a boats systems; In the mid 70’s to the early 80’s it was common practice to winterize water systems and engines with this.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>It was cheap and seemed to work well enough. <SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>As time went on and people became more aware of the dangers, better solutions were developed.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I thought this issue had died completely by the mid 80’s since I’ve not seen it in many years. But after reading the replies to your question, I thought there might be a new windshield washer fluid. So I checked.
T face="Times New Roman" size=3>Today, I found three different versions of windshield washer fluid.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Two contained Methanol and one contained Methyl Alcohol.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Both are alcohol based and all were clearly labeled as poison.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Any amount that remains in a potable water system is a poison risk.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Also alcohol, in particular the “meth” type of alcohol, is hydroscopic, meaning it absorbs water. <SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Good antifreeze, formulated for use in winterizing engines is a blended Propylene Glycol.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>It is non-toxic, bio-degradable, and is formulated to inhibit rust corrosion and helps to lubricate pumps and valves.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Unless there is some make of windshield washer fluid that doesn’t contain poisonous alcohol that I’m not aware of, I’d spend a few extra bucks and use a good, high quality, diluteable antifreeze for your boat and her systems.Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
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David and others;
I’ve been working with this issue of ethanol in gasoline for the last two years.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Please keep in mind that so far, ethanol is only an issue in gasoline.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I am not aware of any Diesel fuel with ethanol added and there are currently no initiatives to add ethanol to diesel.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>That said, if anyone has a boat with an Atomic 4 or other gasoline engine, you may find the following information to be useful in saving you future grief.
Gasoline with 10% ethanol is very common in the U.S. marinas.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Additionally, many owners don’t want to pay the higher prices marinas charge for gas so they use the red jerry-jugs to bring fuel to the boat from the least expensive source.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>And many of these have nothing but E10 gasoline.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>So it is common here and if it’s not in common in Canada yet, it is still something all boaters should be aware of.
In addition to the issue of ethanol dissolving resins in fiberglass fuel tanks as described by BoatUS in their Seaworthy testing, ethanol blended gasoline has been linked to being the cause of fouled fuel filters, damage to aluminum tanks, fuel lines and fuel pumps as well as other engine problems in older marine vessels. pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>There are two major factors about ethanol to be concerned about.
First, ethanol is a very effective cleaning solvent. pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Whatever film and sludge may be lining an old aluminum or steel gasoline fuel tank will likely be loosened by the ethanol and pushed through the fuel filters and the fuel pump on its way into the boats engine.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Anybody who has looked inside an old aluminum gasoline fuel tank can see a dark brown lining.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>This “lining” is a film that is proven to be loosened by ethanol in the gas.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The ramifications of “chunks” of loosened film and sludge flowing toward the filters and pumps are obvious.
Second, ethanol is very hydroscopic, capable of absorbing 100 percent of its weight in water.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>This should concern the boat owner who needs to pay much closer attention to the fuel/water separator.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Some older gas engine installations have only a fuel filter but no water separator, meaning water is making its way into the engine.
guage: AR-SA">As stated above, there are reports of leaking aluminum fuel tanks linked to the use of E10 gasoline; this makes sense given the characteristics of ethanol listed above.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN></SPAN>Aluminum is a highly conductive metal relying on an oxide layer for its corrosion-protection properties.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Low levels of ethanol, such as E10, usually are not a problem in aluminum tanks because the oxide layer provides protection.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>However, there are two mechanisms occurring with ethanol, both are a result of the ethanol absorbing water.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The more ethanol in the fuel, the more water there will be in the fuel tank.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Water not only corrodes the tank, it also causes the corrosion particles to clog fuel filters, fuel systems and damage engine components.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The corrosion rate can be accelerated under a number of conditions if other contaminating metals are present, such as copper, which could be picked up from brass fittings or as a low-level contaminant in the aluminum alloy.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>In the long term, corrosion can perforate the aluminum, producing leaks and causing fuel spillage into the bilge.
The second mechanism involved here is "galvanic corrosion."pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Gasoline fuel is not conductive, but the presence of ethanol or ethanol and water will conduct electricity.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The galvanic process affecting drives shaft, shaft couplings and so on also will occur within the aluminum tank.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The best protection against galvanic corrosion within the fuel tank is to make certain the fuel tank is properly bonded and/or that there is no water in the fuel tank by the use of a separate water separator in the fuel line system.
In any event, the saying that cleanliness is next to godliness is true with regard to your fuel system as well.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>A clean fuel system means that E10 will only help keep it clean (provided you can separate the water effectively.) pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Also it is important to have access to be able to quickly change fuel filters if necessary.pacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Frequently monitor the fuel tank for leaks by maintaining a clean bilge and monitoring for gasoline leaks into the bilge.Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
size=3>I realize your question here is specifically directed at getting insight from other MK V owners regarding your C&C 24 jack stands working for your MK V, but there are many who use jack stands and this may be a good time and place to open the broader subject. There are as many differing opinions on this subject as there are marinas, boats and boat owners.n: yes"> </SPAN>And many people have done things differently than recommended below for years with no adverse effect.n: yes"> </SPAN>Your stands may work fine but I’m offering the following as advice from a highly respected and authoritative source, the insurers of the marinas and owners who end up paying claims every year from boats not blocked properly.n: yes"> </SPAN>Their investigations of the claims have provided insight as to best practices when it comes to preventing future accidents.n: yes"> </SPAN>In the most recent issue of Seaworthy magazine, The BOAT/U.S. Marine Insurance and Damage Avoidance Report (October 2007), there is a great article titled "Blocking Ashore." The Right Way and the Wrong Way. n: yes"> </SPAN>If you don’t subscribe to this magazine, you can order a free single issue online at <A href="http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy"> size=3>www.boatus.com/seaworthy</A> size=3>.n: yes"> </SPAN>In a nut shell, their recommendations for jack stands are:
size=3>Use pairs, port and starboard, for every 10 feet of a boats length (6 recommended for the 27) plus a bow support.n: yes"> </SPAN>(I realize many cradles have 4 supports plus the bow but jack stands are not cradles.)
size=3>Place the stands so the adjusting screw is as perpendicular to the hull as possible and they should be positioned outboard as far as possible.
size=3>Safety chains on all stands, tightly chaining pairs together from port to starboard.n: yes"> </SPAN>Rope is not suitable as it stretches.
size=3>Never tie the cover/tarp to the jack stands as strong winds can catch the cover and move the stand.
size=3>Plywood should be placed under the jack stand, even on asphalt & brick hard yard surfaces.n: yes"> </SPAN>If the stand sinks, even a fraction of an inch, it can begin the “wiggling effect.”
size=3>Never add blocking between the pad and the boat as it can slip out and never block beneath the jack stand in an effort to raise the stand as it can move and fail.
size=3>Check the blocking periodically.n: yes"> </SPAN>Check to see that the pads are not depressing the hull.
size=3>Hope this helps.Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; mso-margin-top-alt: auto; mso-margin-bottom-alt: auto">There are no new changes to the documentation process in the United States but there are several misconceptions. </SPAN>In the United States vessel documentation is a national form of registration. </SPAN>It is one of the oldest functions of our Government, dating back to the 11th Act of the First Congress. </SPAN>Originally, documentation was to provide conclusive evidence of nationality for international purposes and provided for unhindered commerce between the states. </SPAN>It also admitted vessels to certain restricted trades, such as coastwise trade and the fisheries. </SPAN>Since 1920, vessel financing has been enhanced through the availability of preferred mortgages on documented vessels. </SPAN>A preferred mortgage is a mortgage which is given status as a maritime lien. </SPAN>As such it enjoys a certain priority in the event of default. </SPAN>In addition, the Coast Guard is prohibited from making certain changes in documentation including, but not limited to, change of vessel ownership, name, and hailing port without consent of the mortgagee. </SPAN>For this reason many financial institutions require vessels which are eligible for documentation, and usually for vessels of considerable value, to be documented and to have preferred mortgages recorded against them. </SPAN>Later, vessel documentation became a way to avoid registering the boat with the state and thereby avoiding state taxes regarding sales and registration taxes. </SPAN>That loop-hole has been closed and today all documented vessels must comply with the laws of the state in which they are operated. </SPAN>I believe all states require state registration and to display the state decals showing that they have complied with the state requirements. </SPAN>I believe that a documented vessel, that is state registered and displaying the decals need not display State Registration Numbers but the vessel's current Certificate of Documentation must be shown to state law enforcement personnel upon their demand. </SPAN>A Certificate of Documentation is valid for one year from the date of issue, providing there are no changes other than a change of owner's address. </SPAN>I believe the one-time new Certificate of Documentation fee is 133.00. </SPAN>The Certificate must be renewed on an annual basis or it will expire. </SPAN>Even though it is up to the owner to assure the document does not expire, the Coast Guard will send a Notice of Renewal to the managing owner approximately 45 days prior to expiration. </SPAN>There is no fee for the yearly renewal, other than the cost of the stamp as was stated by Iris.</SPAN>Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
Times New Roman" size=3>Ken;
Times New Roman" size=3>There are many installations of a “chain locker” (which around the great lakes and on our smaller vessels is actually a little bit of chain and mostly anchor rode), some by the manufacturers and some by owners as you’re contemplating.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The good ones; have a hawse hole and pipe large enough to allow the rode to easily fall into the deep locker, are drained with at least one drain either through the stem or to one side but in either case at the very bottom of the locker; have ventilation into the fore cabin allowing the air flow to dry the rode completely and; have easy, quick access to the locker from the fore cabin in case there are any hockles in the rode.
Times New Roman" size=3>The upside to a stem drain is that it typically won’t require a topsides thru-hull that is necessary if you were to drain to port or starboard.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The down side is that the locker should be deep enough to allow the rode to fall into the locker, so the stem drain is necessarily low and subject to water intake if you were to leave calm waters and venture into the open waters of the lake and plow into three or four footers.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>But that is true of a deeply placed side drain as well.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I’m not a fan of draining the chain locker to the bilge.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Roger’s comments about letting the rode dry on deck likely serves him well but I’ve never been able to do that as I’m usually sailing off the hook and need the rode off the deck.
Times New Roman" size=3>The ventilation from the hawse hole alone is usually not enough to effectively dry the rode or to prevent the rode and locker from growing mold and mildew so sealing the locker with a gasketed removable bulkhead may not be your best solution.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>You may want to consider a louvered, hinged door for both quick access and ventilation.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>This is akin to hanging your wet sheets and lines in the cabin or the lazarette to dry after you’ve been sailing.
Times New Roman" size=3>There are many good comments from the forum participants and David’s regarding sealing the hawse hole thru-deck is extremely important. yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I’m an avid single-hander so am also a fan of dropping the anchor off the stern and walking the rode to the bow as has been described.yle="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>When picking up, I’ll hang the wet rode on the pushpit till drained and dry or until I use it again at the end of the day.Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"
mes New Roman" size=3>Ken;
mes New Roman" size=3>I’m not sure what Vetus waterlift wet exhaust system is best for your application.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The issues around a correct system installation involve back pressure to the engine, water siphoning, as well as carbon monoxide migration and heat transfer from hot exhaust pipes in front of the waterlift.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Some of the ramifications of an incorrect installation may become apparent within an hour of the installation (but not before damage is done) while other consequences may not manifest themselves for a long time.
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There is a considerable difference between a wet exhaust system for a Yanmar diesel engine and an Atomic 4 gasoline engine.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Your wet exhaust system should be specific to the Atomic 4 in your boat.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>There is probably none more knowledgeable regarding every aspect of the Atomic 4 than the folks at Moyer Marine Inc.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>There is an interesting thread in their forum regarding a sailor who installed a Vetus system for the Atomic 4 in his Catalina 27.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>You should be able to find the thread under Vetus Waterlock Melting on the moyermarine web site.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>That should give you a clue as to the importance of a correct installation.
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Regarding finding a secure way to fasten it down; if you use the “can type” of water lift sold by Moyer Marine Inc. and others, it is typically fastened to a leveled wood shelf that is fixed to the hull with epoxy.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>If the “Towser” installation would have been installed by Yanmar, it would probably have had a thin teak wood platform secured to the hull with epoxy and then the tank secured to the wood with a nylon strap.
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Another observation I’d like to interject here is the clamping of the flexible exhaust hoses.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The purpose of double clamping is to provide a “secure, liquid and vapor-tight joint.”e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Placing the “knuckle” of each clamp on the same side technically meets the requirement of double clamping but misses the point of the purpose.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>A hose clamp provides the most tightening from the centerline toward the knuckle.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>It is best to place the knuckles on opposing sides, thus providing the most tightening force equally on both sides of the clamped hose.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>I have been involved in cases of carbon monoxide migration, caused by back pressure, through improper clamping.e="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Since you’re putting two clamps on anyway, why not do it right.Scott Schoeler, MKIII, "Scot-Free"