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I went with Harken turning blocks on the boom for the leech reefing line then from the mast brought back to the cockpit along the deck, and I may use hooks at the gooseneck for the luff reef cringle, but for now I'll rig a second line that ties off at the mast until the crew and I decide which method we like best. Once we get the first reef point figured out, I'll rig the second one.
Although there are lots of options, the favoured seems to be not the one-line but a two-line, or leech line + gooseneck hook. Also seems favoured not to bother trying to bring all those lines back to the cockpit, since crew usually has to go forward anyway to tuck the sail and tie the nettles.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
There is no reefing system on this C&C 27 Mark II, so I can do anything. Can I get away with a simple single-line system on this boat like the one Harken sells, or is a two-line system preferred? I want to bring the lines back to the cockpit on rope clutches.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Check out Jatoba wood. On the east coast it is a third the price of teak, and to my amateur eye it seems to have many of the same properties of teak. I've used it on two boats. The first piece I got was a little light in colour, but for the last project the piece I got varnished up the same as surrounding teak in the boat. Jatoba was recommended to me by two hardwood specialists. East Coast Specialty Hardwoods in the Halifax area is well worth a visit for those who can make it there. It's like a wood museum.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Thanks for all the encouragement in this thread. Just splashed the boat back in after the tropical storms. Took advantage of being out to install a PSS seal on our A4 C&C 27. Seems to be working great.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Both sails on our new to us C&C 27 are numbered 24068. PO's agree the sails were made for the boat within the past few years, but cannot recall where the numbers came from. Hull number is 402. I checked with the two different sail makers but they have no idea. Any thoughts? Thanks.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
We had ours soda-blasted ours last summer at the start of the refit -- he did a great job. I went over the hull afterward with an orbital sander to get the last bits of bottom paint, but he got 98% of it down to the gelcoat, with no sign of gelcoat damage. Very satisfied.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
1.5" is normal, but be careful to ensure that the 1.5" inch hose fits the 1.5" fittings. Forespar Marelon 1.5" antisiphon loop and y-valve fittings and most modern marine toilets will fit modern high-quality 1.5" marine sewage hose, but that hose is almost impossible to get onto several older 1.5" fittings, which seem to be a tad larger. I bought the hose first and then took a short section with me when I went shopping for the other parts.
Nothing in a marine toilet that has not been eaten.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Thank you. To summarize (is this right?):
USHRF-PHRF: C&C27Assoc; C&COriginal
C&C 27-1 IB: Mark I inboard engine; C&C 1.
C&C 27-1 OB: Mark I outboard engine; C&C 1.
C&C 27-1 TM: Mark II tall mast; C&C 1A.
C&C 27-2 <914: Mark III (914=hull number) C&C 2.
C&C 27-2 +915: Mark IV (915=hull number): C&C 3.
C&C 27-3 IB: Mark V inboard engine; C&C 27.
C&C 27-3 OB: Mark V outboard engine; C&C 27.
C&C 27-3 SD: Mark V shoal draft (keel 3'6" instead of 4'10"); C&C 27.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Now that we're sailing and racing, the club needs to give our boat a PHRF rating. I've been asked to pick a base model from the list our club uses. Turns out to be a bit of a head scratcher. Am I right to assume that our 1974 C&C 27 with a mast height of 35 feet and hull number in the 216 to 451 range is a "C&C 27-1 TM"? Here is the information I've summarized from various sources to arrive at that conclusion:
C&C produced four versions of the original 27:
Mark 1 - Generally known as the Mark I. Hulls 1 to 215 were produced from 1970 to 1972.
Mark 1A "Tall Rig" - Generally known as the Mark II. Hulls 216 to 451 produced from late 1972 to 1974.
Mark 2 - Generally known as the Mark III. Hulls 451 to 914 produced from 1974 to 1981.
Mark 3 - Generally known as the Mark IV. Hulls 915 to 984 produced from 1981 to 1982.
See <a href="../../evolution.html">http://www.cc27association.com/evolution.html</a># for details of Marks 1 (I) to 3 (IV).
After production of the Mark 3 (IV) ceased, C&C introduced a completely new boat named the C&C 27; this boat is generally known as the Mark V. See <a href="../../vchange.html">http://www.cc27association.com/vchange.html</a>
I see there are different PHRF ratings in various regions. Here is the list of C&C 27 desginations from the one our club starts with, and what I think they mean: (United States Handicap Racing Fleet <a href="http://offshore.ussailing.org/Assets/Offshore/PHRF/Critical+Dimensions.pdf">http://offshore.ussailing.org/Assets/Offshore/PHRF/Critical+Dimensions.pdf</a> where we had to guess at the two-letter acronyms)
C&C 27-1 IB: Mark I inboard engine.
C&C 27-1 OB: Mark I outboard engine.
C&C 27-1 TM: Mark II tall mast - the Mark 1A?
C&C 27-2 +915: Mark III If 915 is hull number, then this would be Mark 3?
C&C 27-2 <914: Mark III If 914 is hull number, then this would be Mark 2?
C&C 27-3 IB: Mark IV inboard engine
C&C 27-3 OB: Mark IV outboard engine
C&C 27-3 SD: Mark IV shoal draft? What does that mean?
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
It is possible to replace the old copper line with 5/16" marine A-1 fuel hose. We have an Atomic 4, so I added a solid Racor fuel/water separator up at the tank, and a polishing filter between fuel pump and carb. Moyer Marine <a href="http://www.moyermarine.com/">http://www.moyermarine.com/</a> sells all that for the A4s. For specs on marine fuel systems, check these documents:
1. Canada Construction Standards for Small Vessels. TP1332E Transport Canada
2. U.S. Boatbuilder's Handbook Subpart J Fuel Systems Title 33 CFR, Sections 183.501-183.590.
3. ABYC standard H-24 Gasoline Fuel Systems.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Another option some use around here is to make two stainless steel plates, one bolted to each side of the base plate. Each plate is bent outward lengthwise about 45 degrees. The lower vertical half is drilled to accomodate the horizontal bolts in the mast base (which will need longer bolts) plus perhaps a couple of extra small bolts for security, and the upper half that sticks out 45 degrees is drilled for 3-4 blocks on each side. Insert anticorrosion between the base and stainless.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
I'm also thinking of making SS rails for each side of the mast base and bolting them onto the base, then shackling the blocks to those. Any thoughts?
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Thanks for all the opinions. I ended up replacing the old Whale hand pumps with new Whale Galley Gusher Mark IV's. Drop-dead easy. They simply went into the old holes and worked first time. Crew is happy. I took a hard look at the foot pumps, but we decided the convenience of having two hands free did not win out over the added cost, larger size, cutting into the cabinets and building a support for the pump.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Finally got to that point in this major refit where I can concentrate on rigging. Mast is up, new deck organizers and rope clutches are in. It is now apparent that I need to rethink the mast base blocks for the halyards. I found the few archived posts but not a full discussion. Presently, the blocks for the main and two foresail halyards are simply blocks shackled to a bale. The point of turn of the halyards is too high, creating too much of an angle where they enter the organizers. I could remove the bale and shackle the blocks to the horizontal bolt in the base but my first incliincation is to change to Harken blocks that I can bolt to the deck at the base of the mast. However, I see the comment to use the mast base instead and not deck-mount base blocks. Any thoughts?
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Well, moving the stanchion bases to the toerail and replacing the lifelines was not a trivial job. Almost done, but it definitely has been one of the fiddliest and most prolonged tasks in the refit. I may do up a Black Arts submission next winter for David to consider.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Martin, don't mind cheerful gruffness- post away and filter what you need. This forum has been very, very helpful as we refit our new to us old C&C 27. I must remember to mail my renewal membership cheque -- sorry David, just a very busy summer here.
David has a good point about not running ice box effluent through the water pump. We never drink boat water, and we try to keep food well contained so that only melted ice or condensed water gets into that drain, but there will be the day when something undesireable gets in that hose. Furthermore, all the extra plumbing for a T does not make as much sense as a simple hand pump on the ice box drain hose.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
I am replacing the old stove on our Mark II, but I don't know if it is your brand or original. This is a 2-burner stove that was 110-volt and non-pressurized alcohol, with a black lid that lifts up to acccess the burners. It is not gimballed.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
I have been modernizing the deck layout on an old Mark II. Following the experience of others, I've been cutting into the headliner to fit fender washers and nylon locknuts onto throughbolts inside after potting pilot holes outside with hardened epoxy to protect the balsa core and redrilling final holes through the hardened epoxy. Once I've got all the hardware installed, I'll figure out how to hide the cutouts in the headliner, probably using bits of teak, or maybe painting bits of plastic and screwing them on. I replaced the old 3-sheave line organizers with 4-sheave (each sheave has a through-bolt, whereas the originals used screws into the balsa, which thankfully was still white and dry), reduced the coach-head winches from 4 to 2, and removed all the old cleats. I am installing rope clutches ahead of the two winches. I agree about not using the companionway cover for running rigging hardware loads.
I also found the ice box drain hose lying in the bilge when we bought the boat. During the refit, I installed a small removable access hatch on the engine space wall just over the ice box drain, and re-routed the hose over to the sink cabinet. I'm installing a Whale foot pump there for the freshwater line and and thining about also running the ice box drain hose into the sink via that pump using a 3-way valve and a prepump inline filter to catch the icebox crud.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
Marcus, where did you install the foot pumps? I'm thinking the one in the galley could go under the sink with the pedal sticking through the base of the cabinet toward the outboard corner, so it is less in the way. Less certain about the head, since the cabinet under the sink is already full of throughulls and toilet hoses. If you have photos, that would be great.
Thanks for the heads up on the value of the more expensive pumps.
We miss the pressurized hot and cold running water from the last boat, but plan to make do with manual pumps and boiling water on this smaller boat.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
The apparently original hand lever pumps on the galley and head sinks are toast, done, finished. Time for new. I searched the archives here and did not find much on C&C 27 discussion. David went for Whale foot pumps, I gather, and likes them. Someone else did not like them. They are expensive (C$100 each). My question: do the hand lever style pumps work and last a reasonable length of time, or are they a pain to prime, and prone to short lives?
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
The Edson website has great downloadable manuals and maintenance guides. <a href="http://www.edsonmarine.com/">http://www.edsonmarine.com/</a>
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
On our Mark II, the original companionway hatch does not seal out weather. There are gaps at the top of the vertical removable hatch board where it meets the horizontal sliding hatch cover. What have people done to weather-seal those gaps, particularly when away from the boat? I'm thinking about making a small canvas storm cover that fits over the joint and snaps down on either side. Some solutions get pretty elaborate: <a href="http://cruisingresources.com/Companionways">http://cruisingresources.com/Companionways</a> .
The dodger keeps weather out when we are around, but sometimes at the dock the wind blows rain under the dodger and at the hatch. And pre-post launch when the dodger is off and the boat is not in its winter cover, that gap is vulnerable.
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1974 Mark II C&C 27
The boom track on the aft side of the mast extends right to the deck. Is there any reason I cannot remove the lower one foot of that track to gain access to the mast for my new mast wire entry system?
David, Phew, those are much lower than I'm hearing now. Where do you recommend checking for sources in Ontario?
Has anybody priced sidestay replacements for C&C 27's lately, or have any guidance for what to expect for cost?